I realize now, that I worded the question in the survey very poorly. Asking questions is an art, and sometimes you don’t know what you’ve really asked, until you start getting answers. The correct answer, of course, is a combination. As Christy said,
Christy Tucker said, April 3, 2007 @ 9:49 am
The crux of my argument is that we should teach it as a separate class AND integrate it into the curriculum, rather than treating it as an either/or proposition.
I was actually looking for some opinions about expecting students to learn it themselves, but as Alfred said,
Alfred Thompson said, April 3, 2007 @ 10:02 am
Kids learn some of these applications on their own but seldom learn enough of them. For example they often set page numbers and page breaks manually which defeats much of the advantage word processing software brings. So at some level they need someone to teach them some of the non obvious features.
This is a very good point, but I would suspect that eventually, they would learn the more advanced features in much the same way that many of us did, by starting to ask, “What else can this thing do?” I continue to think about how they learn to play World of Warcraft and The SIMS, and I suspect that much of it is from each other. Can we institute opportunities in our schools where they can learn more from each other? Teaching it, in a traditional sense, costs so much overhead.
Rob Rogers describes what I suspect would be the ideal,
Rob Rogers said, April 3, 2007 @ 7:13 am
5 Years ago we were teaching 10 sections of Computer Applications at the high school, just like you mention above. Now, we have fully integrated it into middle school subject areas. The result, I now have 2 sections only.
At this time, these skills and applications are best taught within a discipline. What better way to reinforce the skills than with content that those application skills enhance or fit.
My nagging question continues to be, are all classroom teachers ready or inclined to teach word processing and spreadsheets at the same time they are responsible for teaching reading, math, social studies, or science? Is it fair to them to ask it?
I guess that the more that I engage in these conversations through the web and face-to-face, the more I’m realizing how much the idea of self-teaching is influencing my responses, that “the best thing we can be teaching our children today, is how to teach themselves.”
Floyd Geasland commented that many students still do not have convenient access to technology outside the classroom and others echoed this situation. But I can’t help but believe that the longer we except this as a problem, the longer it will be one. I think that we have to be real, but we also need to come to expect that learners in this day and time, should have at-hand access to contemporary information technologies. It’s a huge community/national/world problem that needs to be solved. But it won’t until we start to expect it!
I like where Patrick went with this conversation,
Patrick said, April 3, 2007 @ 7:31 am
Speaking from a personal standpoint, I would like to see a computer applications class taught, but not from a Microsoft Office standpoint. …Why not use the Comp Apps class to introduce the students to some of the great data mashups out there, or some of the online office suites that this generation might see in their work experiences? Instead of doing away with it, we should use it as a vehicle for change, to teach problem solving skills as the pertain to choosing the best application for a specific endeavor. In this era of unknown problems and uncertain solutions, demonstrating how to find the right app will be a useful skill.
There is so much that is going on right now, that is growing, and coming to define our future, that isn’t getting taught (or learned). Many kids are using Web 2.0 applications, but I do not believe that they understand it. They don’t know why it is important and what it means. It needs to be part of their classroom conversations.
Back to the beginning, I think that most of our students, today, are capable of teaching themselves what they need to know, when it comes to using technology, especially when they can learn it together. Frequently, when they are engaged in their outside-the-classroom information experience, they are practicing what John Finch called, and Kathy Schrock echoed as “Just in time, just enough” learning.
John Finch said, April 3, 2007 @ 10:38 am
Like anything, “just in time, just enough†is the way that people should learn software applications and this learning should be done in context. When we learn to drive, the most important thing is the driving! We familiarize ourselves with signs and rules as we watch others drive but we have to actually get behind the wheel to learn to DRIVE.
Kathy Schrock echos, April 3, 2007 @ 5:49 pm
I truly believe technology can only be taught in the context of something meaningful and I love John Finch’s quote above “Like anything, “just in time, just enough†is the way that people should learn software applications and this learning should be done in context.â€
My bottom line, we need to assure that our children have the basic information (literacy) skills, which include the abilities to use technologies necessary to find, evaluate, work, and compellingly express information in order to accomplish meaningful goals. Some of it needs to be taught. But anything that we can facilitate their teaching to themselves, we should do.
Finally, I have to repost Jennifer Wagners comment, because it deserves it.
Jennifer Wagner said, April 3, 2007 @ 9:23 am
My students learned to how to use Excel by having an introductory game of Battleship. That is how they learned cells and columns. We all had fun — and we learned.
My students learned how to rewrite a fairy tale by using the thesaurus tool in Word. And my students created their own business plans — presented powerpoints, budgets, webpages, spreadsheets, and more — and then we had 3 “venture capitalists†come in to hear the presentations and awarded $$$ (ie — scores) based on their belief of the business.
My students created parks in roller coaster tycoon (or zoo tycoon) and keep spreadsheets to track their company assets.
My students word documented their experiences in Oregon Trail, their days in Logical Journey, and they used a spreadsheet to keep track of their missions in Carmen San Diego.
The funny thing — I really don’t ever remember saying “Open (gill in the name of a Office program) and we are going to learn how to….blah blah blah. The program was only a means to the end………
Even now — with the Great Egg Roll 2007 going on — using Excel is not the main objective. Entering data to be analyzed later is.
Grins — I am not sure I am really answering your question — but it did make me think of how I used programs.
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